2601
jds_blackcougar
Re: New Member
07/09/2006 14:27:00
--- In BlackShadow@yahoogroups.com, "Roger Stanyard" <roger@...> wrote:
>
> --- In BlackShadow@yahoogroups.com, "jds_blackcougar"
> <jds_blackcougar@> wrote:
> >
> > Hi,
> >
> > My name's Josh (sorry no surname as that's one of my online forum
> rules)
>
> Sorry Josh,
>
> Identify yourself or go.
>
> It's better you join CED or debunkcreation.
>
> Roger
>
> >
>
Sorry, but I never reveal my personal details online.
I have numerous contacts within the creationist community in the UK so
I thought I may be of benefit (Such as I know what Philip Bell is up
to currently).
If you do wish to remove me from your group, please do so
your loss
Josh
2602
jds_blackcougar
Re: New Member
07/09/2006 14:30:00
--- In BlackShadow@yahoogroups.com, "oeditor" <b-jordan@...> wrote:
>
> --- In BlackShadow@yahoogroups.com, "Roger Stanyard" <roger@> wrote:
> >
> > --- In BlackShadow@yahoogroups.com, "jds_blackcougar"
> > <jds_blackcougar@> wrote:
> > >
> > > Hi,
> > >
> > > My name's Josh (sorry no surname as that's one of my online forum
> > rules)
> >
> > Sorry Josh,
> >
> > Identify yourself or go.
> >
> > It's better you join CED or debunkcreation.
>
> What's the point of making the group private and expelling Nick Cowan,
> if admitted creationists like Josh can join at will?
> Surely some mistake?
>
> Brian
>
I joined because of the following:
>Our Yahoo forum is open to anyone wishing to contribute ideas, links,
articles, expertise, files and photos or discuss specific issues.
>It is also open to creationists who wish to engage in stimulating
intellectual debate – or just have a good fight. Membership is by
approval only.
If I misunderstood this please inform me.
Josh
2603
oeditor
Re: Yahoo Group Changes
07/09/2006 14:57:00
--- In BlackShadow@yahoogroups.com, "Ian Lowe" <ian@...> wrote:
>
> I would need someone else to act as a moderator for the new list, as
I am > unable to do so. I would expect the moderator(s) of this list
to perform the> same duties on the forum I provide.
>
While I don't want to moderate a group, I'd be happy to do the
technical admin - if there is any.
Is there an example anywhere of what we would get?
Brian
2604
Roger Stanyard
Re: New Member
07/09/2006 15:19:00
--- In BlackShadow@yahoogroups.com, "jds_blackcougar"
<jds_blackcougar@...> wrote:
>
> --- In BlackShadow@yahoogroups.com, "oeditor" <b-jordan@> wrote:
> >
> > --- In BlackShadow@yahoogroups.com, "Roger Stanyard" <roger@>
wrote:
> > >
> > > --- In BlackShadow@yahoogroups.com, "jds_blackcougar"
> > > <jds_blackcougar@> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > Hi,
> > > >
> > > > My name's Josh (sorry no surname as that's one of my online
forum
> > > rules)
> > >
> > > Sorry Josh,
> > >
> > > Identify yourself or go.
> > >
> > > It's better you join CED or debunkcreation.
> >
> > What's the point of making the group private and expelling Nick
Cowan,
> > if admitted creationists like Josh can join at will?
> > Surely some mistake?
> >
> > Brian
> >
>
> I joined because of the following:
>
> >Our Yahoo forum is open to anyone wishing to contribute ideas,
links,
> articles, expertise, files and photos or discuss specific issues.
> >It is also open to creationists who wish to engage in stimulating
> intellectual debate – or just have a good fight. Membership is by
> approval only.
>
> If I misunderstood this please inform me.
>
> Josh
>
Jeez, which bit of "membership by approval only" does this guy not
understand.
2605
Roger Stanyard
Re: New Member
07/09/2006 15:16:00
--- In BlackShadow@yahoogroups.com, "oeditor" <b-jordan@...> wrote:
>
>
>
> What's the point of making the group private and expelling Nick Cowan,
> if admitted creationists like Josh can join at will?
> Surely some mistake?
>
> Brian
>
Dead right Brian,
Josh was the one I mentioned yesterday that I didn't know about in this
group.
He joined a few days ago and I asked him to identify himself.
My general policy is that I cannot guarantee absolutely security but to
reduce the risk I am asking all newcomers to identify themselves. I'm
doing that by private email.
Josh was asked a couple of days back IIRC. As we weren't closed user
group he could see everything anyway. I gave him a bit of extra leeway
for a day or so to give him time to reply.
The fact that I insisted he identified himself means that we know he is
a creationist, btw.
From what I can see from his posting, btw, his name appears to be
Joshua Cotton.
Did a search and can find nobody of that name in the UK. He comes from
Derby, btw. It wouldn't surprise me that he was at Ham's Leicester do
last Friday. Derby isn't far away.
,
2606
oeditor
Re: New Member
07/09/2006 15:21:00
--- In BlackShadow@yahoogroups.com, "jds_blackcougar"
<jds_blackcougar@...> wrote:
>
> --- In BlackShadow@yahoogroups.com, "oeditor" <b-jordan@> wrote:
> >
>
> I joined because of the following:
>
> >Our Yahoo forum is open to anyone wishing to contribute ideas, links,
> articles, expertise, files and photos or discuss specific issues.
> >It is also open to creationists who wish to engage in stimulating
> intellectual debate – or just have a good fight. Membership is by
> approval only.
>
> If I misunderstood this please inform me.
>
Nothing personal mate. It's just that we've had a long discussion
whether the group should be made closed, and very recently decided
that it should. I expect that the intro will be modified in that
light. However, the group has always had a rule that membership
requires approval and so do posts from new members. In the light of
this, and Roger's reply to your message, it looks as though the filter
isn't working. That would also explain how another person was able to
join and surprise us.
Over to Roger.
Brian
2607
oeditor
Re: New Member
07/09/2006 15:35:00
--- In BlackShadow@yahoogroups.com, "Roger Stanyard" <roger@...> wrote:
>
> Jeez, which bit of "membership by approval only" does this guy not
> understand.
>
Like I said, surely some mistake. If I wanted to join such a group,
I'd fill in the form and wait to be accepted or rejected. Which I
imagine is what Josh did.
But I'd also expect that my application would go into a mail box and
nothing would happen until the moderator had made a decision. Is this
filter not working? How is it supposed to work, for that matter?
Brian
2608
Wankle Rotary-Pyjamas
Re: Re: New Member
07/09/2006 15:34:00
Going by the hotmail address you gave to the group (jc0tt0n *at* hotmail *dot*
com), I don't suppose your surname would be Cotton, would it Josh?
Phil.
----------
>Hi,
>My name's Josh (sorry no surname as that's one of my online forum rules)
2609
Ian Lowe
RE: Re: Yahoo Group Changes
07/09/2006 15:39:00
Gimme ten minutes, and I'll knock up an example.
-----Original Message-----
From: BlackShadow@yahoogroups.com [BlackShadow@yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of oeditor
Sent: 07 September 2006 14:58
To: BlackShadow@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [BlackShadow] Re: Yahoo Group Changes
--- In BlackShadow@yahoogroups.com, "Ian Lowe" <ian@...> wrote:
>
> I would need someone else to act as a moderator for the new list, as
I am > unable to do so. I would expect the moderator(s) of this list
to perform the> same duties on the forum I provide.
>
While I don't want to moderate a group, I'd be happy to do the
technical admin - if there is any.
Is there an example anywhere of what we would get?
Brian
Yahoo! Groups Links
2610
Roger Stanyard
Re: New Member
07/09/2006 15:46:00
--- In BlackShadow@yahoogroups.com, "oeditor" <b-jordan@...> wrote:
>
> --- In BlackShadow@yahoogroups.com, "jds_blackcougar"
> <jds_blackcougar@> wrote:
> >
> > --- In BlackShadow@yahoogroups.com, "oeditor" <b-jordan@> wrote:
> > >
> >
> > I joined because of the following:
> >
> > >Our Yahoo forum is open to anyone wishing to contribute ideas,
links,
> > articles, expertise, files and photos or discuss specific issues.
> > >It is also open to creationists who wish to engage in stimulating
> > intellectual debate – or just have a good fight. Membership is by
> > approval only.
> >
> > If I misunderstood this please inform me.
> >
> Nothing personal mate. It's just that we've had a long discussion
> whether the group should be made closed, and very recently decided
> that it should. I expect that the intro will be modified in that
> light. However, the group has always had a rule that membership
> requires approval and so do posts from new members. In the light of
> this, and Roger's reply to your message, it looks as though the
filter
> isn't working. That would also explain how another person was able
to
> join and surprise us.
>
> Over to Roger.
>
> Brian
>
Josh has now left the group.
The way it is set up at present is that anyone wanting to join the
group sends an email which goes through Yahoo to my normal private
email account.
I can then decide on the basis of the introduction given by them
(which doesn't appear in the postings) to let them in or ask for
further information.
However, I can only actuall let then join if I go into Yahoo.
Moreover, the way we have Yahoo set up is that they are automatically
on moderated status when they join. I have to change their status
manually to allow them to post unmoderated.
In virtually all cases I have maintained the moderated status for the
first posting of someone I don't really know, afterwhich they are
unmoderated.
However, in general, I hope the approach I am taking is relatively
secure.
I must admit that I had moxed feelings about Josh. I didn't believe
for one minute that he would start giving information away about
Philip Bell and his connections in the creationist movement. He
was "shilling" and even made pretty clear that he intended to use us.
However, we may have got something a la Nick Cowan which would have
provided background and, indeed, even had a good time giving him the
proverbial group duffing up
2611
oeditor
Re: New Member
07/09/2006 18:52:00
--- In BlackShadow@yahoogroups.com, "Roger Stanyard" <roger@...> wrote:
>
> The way it is set up at present is that anyone wanting to join the
> group sends an email which goes through Yahoo to my normal private
> email account.
>
> I can then decide on the basis of the introduction given by them
> (which doesn't appear in the postings) to let them in or ask for
> further information.
>
Sorry Roger, it just looked as though they were popping into existence
fully formed. It must be difficult to weigh them up before they've
posted much.
>
> I must admit that I had moxed feelings about Josh. I didn't believe
> for one minute that he would start giving information away about
> Philip Bell and his connections in the creationist movement. He
> was "shilling" and even made pretty clear that he intended to use
> us.
>
> However, we may have got something a la Nick Cowan which would have
> provided background and, indeed, even had a good time giving him the
> proverbial group duffing up
>
So perhaps we should go to Ian's idea of a two-level group. Anybody
(unless they're too strident or verbose) could join the discussion
part, but only when they've nailed their colours to the mast would
members be invited to the activist section.
I'm looking forward to see how Ian's demo works.
Brian
2612
Roger Stanyard
Re: Truth in Science - Doctoring the News
07/09/2006 18:48:00
--- In BlackShadow@yahoogroups.com, "Roger Stanyard" <roger@...>
wrote:
>
> I have loaded to the file section of this group two copies of the
> March 2004 newsletter from Take Heed Ministries in Northern Ireland.
>
> So what, you may ask? Well that newsletter is where we found out
all
> our details of Truth in Science,
We have got back the reply from Take Heed Ministries why they
doctored their March 2004 newsletter.
Here is the excuse:
Dear Mr [?] Txxxxx,
Thank you for your email and your kind words about our website.
As a ministry we are pleased when prudent to endorse and encourage
support for any faithful Christian ministry, including 'Truth in
Science' that upholds the truth of creation as outlined in God's
Word, the Bible. They are neither 'a dangerous sect' nor 'defunct'.
As to the article that was on our website the time-frame of
its 'appearance' and 'disappearance' was mutually agreed between our
2 organisations.
I am your servant for the Lord Jesus Christ
Cecil Andrews
'Take Heed' Ministries
2613
ukantic
Black Shadow Nights.
07/09/2006 21:07:00
Out of interest - & now that the group is private, perhaps some
members might be interested in a group I quickly set up to demonstrate
to Roger just how easy it is to create a Yahoo group. I called it BS
Nights after the TV series, Bay Watch Nights, which was a sort of
grown up version of Bay Watch that was on the go some years ago. The
group description is just slapstick. See:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/bsnights/
2614
bonytrux
Trinity in trouble again
07/09/2006 21:29:00
BBc News Look North (Wed 6.9.06)covered the story of Lee Kilgour a
Year 10 pupil sent home for an unacceptable haircut. They have covered
the story again today 7.9.06 because his parents re-did his hair but
Trinity sent him home again. The haircut looks fine to me - I would
have accepted it when I was Head of the school Trinity replaced.
Doncaster Free Press also covered the story today with Lee's father
making comments about Hitler !! No doubt other local papers will cover
it and the nationals may pick it up. Wonderful thing this Christian
tolerance !
2615
Ian Lowe
RE: Re: New Member
07/09/2006 22:00:00
> I'm looking forward to see how Ian's demo works.
Righty. It's ready for a demo - sorry about the delay, had to run some
errands after work.
The forum is here:
http://www.atheistaction.org.uk
That's a domain I had lying around, not being used, so don't panic. It's
just what I had to hand.
Register for an account, and you will get an email back asking you to
confirm your email and activate the account. Once you do, log in.
When you look at the forum as a member of Joe Public, you can see one forum.
When you get an account set up and log in, you should be able to see another
forum.
Post a message to me, and I will add you to a group in the forum called
"organisers". When this is done, you will be able to see another, hidden
forum.
Each forum has a mailing list attached to it.
If you click the "forum subscriptions" button at the top of the screen once
logged in, it allows you to "subscribe" to the email address. That's all
there is to it - if you post in the webforum, it will end up on the mailin
list. If you reply to the mailing list, it will end up in the forum.
Give it a try.
Ian.
PS> I have set this up, but not "tweaked" it - there might be a couple of
niggles to fix, so don't jump to a conclusion without asking me about
anything which doesn't seem to work.
2616
Roger Stanyard
Re: Trinity in trouble again
07/09/2006 23:08:00
--- In BlackShadow@yahoogroups.com, "bonytrux" <bonytrux@...> wrote:
>
> BBc News Look North (Wed 6.9.06)covered the story of Lee Kilgour a
> Year 10 pupil sent home for an unacceptable haircut. They have
covered
> the story again today 7.9.06 because his parents re-did his hair
but
> Trinity sent him home again. The haircut looks fine to me - I would
> have accepted it when I was Head of the school Trinity replaced.
> Doncaster Free Press also covered the story today with Lee's father
> making comments about Hitler !! No doubt other local papers will
cover
> it and the nationals may pick it up. Wonderful thing this Christian
> tolerance !
Bonytrux,
Is there anywhere we can see the story as a video, soundtrack or in
text? Sounds to me like the stuff I loose sleep over.
Roger
2617
Drew Smith
RE: Re: Trinity in trouble again
07/09/2006 23:18:00
Roger: Is there anywhere we can see the story as a video, soundtrack or in
text?
Drew:
http://www.doncastertoday.co.uk/ViewArticle2.aspx?SectionID=786&ArticleID=17
49006
2618
ukantic
ACADEMY OUTSHONE BY FAILING SCHOOL
07/09/2006 23:56:00
THORNE'S fledgling academy has seen a drop in its GCSE pass rate
compared to the 'failing' school it replaced.
http://www.thornetoday.co.uk/ViewArticle2.aspx?SectionID=2225&ArticleID=1732349
http://tinyurl.com/oc9lp
Trinity Academy saw just over 34 per cent of its students gaining at
least five C grades.
When Thorne Grammar School closed last August its headline pass rate
was just over 35 per cent.
But the news has been met with optimism by the Academy, which insists
the results, in the new school's first year, actually represented a
success as the students involved had not been predicted to do as well
as they had.
Principal Ian Brew said: "It was estimated that 32 per cent of our
pupils should get five A-C grades, so I am delighted they have done
better. This year group was not as strong as the previous year and to
be so close to equalling what was for Thorne Grammar the best year
they had had for 10 to 15 years was outstanding."
Campaign
But Tracy Morton, who led a campaign to stop Northcliffe School in
Conisbrough being replaced by and academy, said: "You just can't walk
in overnight and change things.
"There is the suggestion that teachers in the existing schools aren't
trying hard enough. It's not that. It's about complex serious problems
that lead to low GCSE results. You can spend £25 million on a new
building but you could spend it on teachers instead."
However, there was better news for the school, as the results saw 28
students achieving ten or more A* to C grade passes - a record for the
town. And 30 students have scored AA grades in the first half of their
science GCSEs.
Thomas Pickersgill, 16, was on top of the pile with 12 A* to C passes,
joined by Tanya Cairns, Jodie Pugh, James Scott, Joshua Taylor and
Katherine Tomlinson, who each have 11.5 A* to C passes.
Mr Brew added: "This first year had provided a foundation and was a
good solid start. We have always said that it is not possible to turn
around achievement overnight. It takes a lot of effort to raise
standards and aspirations. We have laid firm foundations this year and
I and my team are looking forward to building on that in the future."
2619
ukantic
Re: ACADEMY OUTSHONE BY FAILING SCHOOL
08/09/2006 00:02:00
--- In BlackShadow@yahoogroups.com, "ukantic" <alan@...> wrote:
>
> THORNE'S fledgling academy has seen a drop in its GCSE pass rate
> compared to the 'failing' school it replaced.
>
>
http://www.thornetoday.co.uk/ViewArticle2.aspx?SectionID=2225&ArticleID=1732349
>
> http://tinyurl.com/oc9lp
>
> Trinity Academy saw just over 34 per cent of its students gaining at
> least five C grades.
> When Thorne Grammar School closed last August its headline pass rate
> was just over 35 per cent.
>
> But the news has been met with optimism by the Academy, which insists
> the results, in the new school's first year, actually represented a
> success as the students involved had not been predicted to do as well
> as they had.
>
> Principal Ian Brew said: "It was estimated that 32 per cent of our
> pupils should get five A-C grades, so I am delighted they have done
> better. This year group was not as strong as the previous year and to
> be so close to equalling what was for Thorne Grammar the best year
> they had had for 10 to 15 years was outstanding."
RUBBISH!
Of course there are strong year groups & weak ones, & that has always
been the case. However no one gave a damn about that two years ago,
when the a lynch mod comprising of the Vardy Foundation, the
Government & local council rode into town shooting from the hip. They
wanted blood & did everything possible to denigrate the existing
school & management.
Their main tactic was to focus on what they said were low exam
results. Hardly an article was ever written on the subject that did
not play on the Vardy Foundation's high exam results at Emmanuel
College in Gateshead, although it was obvious that it was absurd to
compare the two schools.
They brought this vicious style of divisive conflict into our
educational system (which is just the tip of the iceberg of their
fundamentalist distain for modern society) so why should they now be
let off the hook. They said they would deliver & they haven't. If they
can't put up – then they should shut up rather than going around
shouting their fundamentalist mouths off about their alleged superiority.
Alan.
2620
oeditor
Re: ACADEMY OUTSHONE BY FAILING SCHOOL
08/09/2006 00:10:00
--- In BlackShadow@yahoogroups.com, "ukantic" <alan@...> wrote:
>
> However, there was better news for the school, as the results saw 28
> students achieving ten or more A* to C grade passes - a record for the
> town. And 30 students have scored AA grades in the first half of their
> science GCSEs.
First half? I knew they'd split the A-levels into two, but GCSEs?
Anyway, what's the good of half the pupils going to university if the
other half can't read and write, let alone count? Shurely shome overlap?
Not dismissive of the poor bloody infantry, by the way, just of the
madmen who are destroying their education.
Brian
2621
Wankle Rotary-Pyjamas
Re: Black Shadow Nights.
08/09/2006 09:33:00
I like the logo ;)
Phil.
P.S. Is this just a demo, or is it intended to be a real group?
----------
>Out of interest - & now that the group is private, perhaps some
>members might be interested in a group I quickly set up to demonstrate
>to Roger just how easy it is to create a Yahoo group. I called it BS
>Nights after the TV series, Bay Watch Nights, which was a sort of
>grown up version of Bay Watch that was on the go some years ago. The
>group description is just slapstick. See:
>
>http://groups.yahoo.com/group/bsnights/
>
2622
JAF
Re: Re: Yahoo Group Changes
08/09/2006 09:47:00
On Thu, 7 Sep 2006 11:10:09 +0100, you wrote:
>I would need someone else to act as a moderator for the new list, as I am
>unable to do so. I would expect the moderator(s) of this list to perform the
>same duties on the forum I provide.
As I wrote to you previously about a similar matter, I'd be happy to do this
- if you think I can be trusted (I can't offer any credentials for evidence,
except to say that the whole concept of god is bollocks, IMO).
--
JAF
anarchatntlworldfullstopcom
2623
Mikey Brass
Re: Re: Yahoo Group Changes
08/09/2006 09:49:00
Ian, if you are proposing a public forum (e.g. this list) and a separate
closed forum (mailing list external to Yahoo), I would agree this is the
best solution.
I would be prepared to act as a co-moderator on the external list.
2624
Ian Lowe
RE: Re: Yahoo Group Changes
08/09/2006 10:03:00
Well,
I have an example up and running - please have a look, try it out, see how
the mail/forum interact.
http://www.atheistaction.org.uk
If this looks like it would be helpful, pick a less "in your face" domain
name, and we can have a replacement up and running in 24 hours.
Roger, if you register an account on this, I can talk you through the admin
interface/demonstrate the configuration.
Ian.
PS> it should be abundantly clear from my other emails, but DO NOT be put
off by this domain name. it's simply the only "vacant" domain I had to hand.
-----Original Message-----
From: BlackShadow@yahoogroups.com [BlackShadow@yahoogroups.com] On
Behalf Of Mikey Brass
Sent: 08 September 2006 09:50
To: BlackShadow@yahoogroups.com
Subject: Re: [BlackShadow] Re: Yahoo Group Changes
Ian, if you are proposing a public forum (e.g. this list) and a separate
closed forum (mailing list external to Yahoo), I would agree this is the
best solution.
I would be prepared to act as a co-moderator on the external list.
Yahoo! Groups Links
2625
JAF
Re: Re: MacKay on BBC News 24
08/09/2006 10:13:00
On Wed, 06 Sep 2006 23:55:37 -0000, you wrote:
>
>It comes up ok in Real Player but I can't see any way to save it.
I've got the whole thing, but can't upload it to the web site as it's 0.93
MB too big (5.93). Anybody want it, I can either email it, or put it on a
(secret, for which I will email the url on request) web page for
downloading.
--
JAF
anarchatntlworldfullstopcom
2626
Mikey Brass
Re: Re: Yahoo Group Changes
08/09/2006 10:15:00
> http://www.atheistaction.org.uk
Nice. I like it.
Is there a facility to receive *all* postings (not just replies to a
thread a person is participating in) by e-mail ?
> If this looks like it would be helpful, pick a less "in your face" domain
I'd agree.
In other words, you are thinking of this yahoogroups list remaining
closed while more public discussions can take place on the message board?
2627
Ian Lowe
RE: Re: Yahoo Group Changes
08/09/2006 10:31:00
> Nice. I like it.
>
>Is there a facility to receive *all* postings (not just replies to a
thread a person is participating in) by e-mail ?
That's how it works - it's a complete 2 way link - anything posted by email
ends up in the forum, anything posted in the forum ends up in email.
You can create a new topic from either web or email just the same, or reply
to an existing thread no matter where it was started.
> In other words, you are thinking of this yahoogroups list remaining
closed while more public discussions can take place on the message board?
My own personal preference would be to ditch Yahoo (with the whole Terms of
Service thing) and use a combined forum/mailing list like this instead.
If you register a temporary account on the site, and log in, you'll see what
I mean - there are three levels of forum/mailing list in place on that
example:
One that's publicly visible, but you have to register to participate (so,
that could be used for open discussions with Nick Cowan etc)
One that's visible to everyone as soon as they register and log in (so, that
could be used for more structured discussion without worrying about it
ending up being indexed by google!)
And one that's visible to only those users who belong to a group on the
forum (which the moderators can invite people to), which could be used for
organising etc without being in the public eye.
I.
2628
Roger Stanyard
Re: Yahoo Group Changes
08/09/2006 10:33:00
--- In BlackShadow@yahoogroups.com, Mikey Brass <michael.brass@...>
wrote:
>
> Ian, if you are proposing a public forum (e.g. this list) and a
separate
> closed forum (mailing list external to Yahoo), I would agree this is
the
> best solution.
>
> I would be prepared to act as a co-moderator on the external list.
Having moderated this site for some three months, I must admit I would
not want to get involved in moderating another.
Roger
2629
Mikey Brass
Re: Re: Trinity in trouble again
08/09/2006 10:40:00
>> Trinity sent him home again. The haircut looks fine to me - I would
>> have accepted it when I was Head of the school Trinity replaced.
There was a kid at my former school who was temporarily banned because
of a haircut, but what happened was that his head was forcibly shaved by
provincial teammates from other schools.
Pupils with hair down their forehead or going over the top of the back
collar would get "asked" to have their hair cut and combed. Rightly so.
Anything outside of those boundaries is, imo, a gross abuse of privileges.
2630
Mikey Brass
Re: Re: Yahoo Group Changes
08/09/2006 10:42:00
> That's how it works - it's a complete 2 way link - anything posted by email
> ends up in the forum, anything posted in the forum ends up in email.
Brilliant. While other people are different, obviously, I prefer
conducting forum correspondence by e-mail.
I am catching up on past mails, btw.
> My own personal preference would be to ditch Yahoo (with the whole Terms of
> Service thing) and use a combined forum/mailing list like this instead.
Just read your other message.
2631
Mikey Brass
Re: Re: Yahoo Group Changes
08/09/2006 11:31:00
I like what Ian has done and propose that it is implemented, under a
domain name which reflects BCSE.
2632
ukantic
Re: Black Shadow Nights.
08/09/2006 22:37:00
--- In BlackShadow@yahoogroups.com, Wankle Rotary-Pyjamas
<wankle_rotary_pyjamas@...> wrote:
>
> I like the logo ;)
I thought you would somehow!
> Phil.
>
> P.S. Is this just a demo, or is it intended to be a real group?
It was just an idea I had for keeping the original BS open for news &
transferring the private stuff across to BS nights. As it stands the
best bet is probably to keep everything together on one forum using
Ian's idea. I'm not sure what to do with BS nights. I've already got
one member, so I might just make them group owner then leave!
Alan.
2633
oeditor
Re: Black Shadow Nights.
08/09/2006 23:58:00
--- In BlackShadow@yahoogroups.com, "ukantic" <alan@...> wrote:
> I've already got
> one member, so I might just make them group owner then leave!
>
Doomed! You're all doomed!
The Member (adopting Scottish accent)
2634
Mikey Brass
Archaeology courses on offering
09/09/2006 14:28:00
Dear all,
I am going to be offering my online archaeology courses again over the
course of the coming six months, starting in a couple of weeks. The
courses and the schedules are given below:
*Saharan archaeology *
Duration: 10 weeks, Sunday 21 January - Saturday 31 March 2007
Cost: £40 / $80
Details: http://www.antiquityofman.com/course_NorthAfrica.html
*World Archaeology (human evolution)*
Duration: 8 weeks, Sunday 24 September - Saturday 18 November August 2006
Cost: £30 / $60
Details: http://www.antiquityofman.com/course_worldarchaeology.html
*The Ancient Egyptian Past*
Duration: 6 weeks, Sunday 24 September - Saturday 04 November 2006
Cost: £30 / $60
Details: http://www.antiquityofman.com/course_AE_general.html
--
Best, Mikey Brass
MA in Archaeology degree, University College London
"The Antiquity of Man" http://www.antiquityofman.com
Book: "The Antiquity of Man: Artifactual, fossil and gene records
explored"
- !ke e: /xarra //ke
("Diverse people unite": Motto of the South African Coat of Arms, 2002)
2635
oeditor
Josh revealed (slightly)
09/09/2006 18:00:00
Still curious, I googled on friend "Josh" and came up with:
http://blackcougar.stumbleupon.com/
I'm sure it's Josh, because if you click on "Discoveries" you find
several AiG books listed. I'm blowed if I can fathom how stumblupon
works though and I don't want to install stumble. It looks as if it
ought to be possible to see his blog, but I can't do it. Any stumblers
here who could have a look?
BTW, I've emailed Derbyshire Secularists asking if they've come across
him.
Brian
2636
ukantic
Pupil sent home in haircut row
09/09/2006 18:59:00
Emma Dunlop
A TEENAGE boy has been banned from a controversial Christian-led city
academy in Yorkshire because he had the wrong haircut.
http://www.yorkshiretoday.co.uk/ViewArticle2.aspx?SectionID=1084&Arti
cleID=1753118
http://tinyurl.com/fhgml
Lee Kilgour, 14, had a "back and sides" cut for his return to the
Vardy Foundation's Trinity Academy in Thorne, Doncaster. But he was
sent home because it fell foul of school regulations.
Parents at the school set up an action group last year after 100
pupils were excluded in its first term amid complaints that children
were stopped from going to the toilet and suspended for walking on the
wrong side of the corridor.
Lee's parents Kay, a home carer, and Gary, a construction manager,
claim he had the same haircut all last year.
Mrs Kilgour said: "His hair is not outrageous or weird. I think he
looks really smart. He is starting his most vital course work at
school for his GCSEs. But what makes it worse is that there are lots
of other boys at the school with the same haircut."
The Vardy Foundation has attracted criticism for its strict views on
Christianity.
A spokesman said three other students were told their hairstyles were
unacceptable but were back after having them cut the same day.
"One other boy was told his style cut into a V-shape at the back of
his head was against the rules. His parent was given the option of
picking him up to get their son's hair trimmed so that he could return
immediately.
"The parent agreed but unfortunately did not wait to hear that the boy
should return to school the same day. We expect him back with the
appropriate hairstyle as soon as possible."
08 September 2006
2637
Mikey Brass
Re: Pupil sent home in haircut row
09/09/2006 19:44:00
ukantic wrote:
> "The parent agreed but unfortunately did not wait to hear that the boy
> should return to school the same day. We expect him back with the
> appropriate hairstyle as soon as possible."
Wrong wrong wrong. The school should have said he was to get his haircut
changed *after* school. Also, I do not believe the master did not have
time to give his full instruction.
2638
Roger Stanyard
Re: Pupil sent home in haircut row
10/09/2006 00:19:00
--- In BlackShadow@yahoogroups.com, "ukantic" <alan@...> wrote:
>
> Emma Dunlop
>
> A TEENAGE boy has been banned from a controversial Christian-led
city
> academy in Yorkshire because he had the wrong haircut.
>
> http://www.yorkshiretoday.co.uk/ViewArticle2.aspx?
SectionID=1084&Arti
> cleID=1753118
>
> http://tinyurl.com/fhgml
>
> Lee Kilgour, 14, had a "back and sides" cut for his return to the
> Vardy Foundation's Trinity Academy in Thorne, Doncaster. But he was
> sent home because it fell foul of school regulations.
Jeez, imagine the average employer doing this to staff! It would be
out of staff and out of business in no time at all.
2639
Roger Stanyard
Re: Josh revealed (slightly)
10/09/2006 00:15:00
--- In BlackShadow@yahoogroups.com, "oeditor" <b-jordan@...> wrote:
>
> Still curious, I googled on friend "Josh" and came up with:
> http://blackcougar.stumbleupon.com/
>
> I'm sure it's Josh, because if you click on "Discoveries" you find
> several AiG books listed. I'm blowed if I can fathom how stumblupon
> works though and I don't want to install stumble. It looks as if it
> ought to be possible to see his blog, but I can't do it. Any stumblers
> here who could have a look?
>
> BTW, I've emailed Derbyshire Secularists asking if they've come across
> him.
Derby is basically on the border with Leicestershire so maybe Leicester
Secular Society may know about him.
I'm buggered if I can found out how stumblupon works. Looks to me to be
utterly amateur and seriously badly thought out.
Just a bit of care with Josh - he claimed to be two years into an
honours degree at the open university but from the information given he
is only 19. That means he hasn't started his second year - he is only
part-time as well.
Moreover, the way the OU works is that effectively its basic degree is
equivalent of a two year degree without honours. Opting for honours is
taken after the pass degree is awarded, not before it.
Roger
2640
Roger Stanyard
New Member
10/09/2006 00:22:00
We have a new potential member who asked to join this evening. I've
asked him to indentify and introduce himeslf before accepting him into
the group.
Roger
2641
oeditor
Re: Josh revealed (slightly)
10/09/2006 01:01:00
--- In BlackShadow@yahoogroups.com, "Roger Stanyard" <roger@...> wrote:
> Just a bit of care with Josh - he claimed to be two years into an
> honours degree at the open university but from the information given he
> is only 19. That means he hasn't started his second year - he is only
> part-time as well.
He seems to have joined the stumblers a year ago, and may not have
updated his profile since then.
> Moreover, the way the OU works is that effectively its basic degree is
> equivalent of a two year degree without honours. Opting for honours is
> taken after the pass degree is awarded, not before it.
Dunno about that. Optimism? If somebody could just penetrate that
stumbledom maze...
OK, if nobody offers, I'll wake up my sacrificial spare computer :-(
Brian
2642
oeditor
Re: Josh revealed (slightly)
10/09/2006 01:29:00
--- In BlackShadow@yahoogroups.com, "oeditor" <b-jordan@...> wrote:
>
> --- In BlackShadow@yahoogroups.com, "Roger Stanyard" <roger@> wrote:
> Dunno about that. Optimism? If somebody could just penetrate that
> stumbledom maze...
> OK, if nobody offers, I'll wake up my sacrificial spare computer :-(
>
OTOH, we/I may not have to. It seems that he has a blog which,
remarkably, needs a password to read.
http://crystal.20six.co.uk/blackcougar
Talk about lights and bushels! However, good old Google has cached it,
and it is indeed he. At first sight, he just sounds like a harmless
young lad. Perhaps Stefan might like to give him a once-over from a
younger point of view?
http://66.249.93.104/search?q=cache:HGiQInqFqgoJ:www.platform27.co.uk/BlackCouga\
r+blackcougar&hl=en&gl=uk&ct=clnk&cd=1&lr=lang_en
= http://tinyurl.com/gcghu
Google on blackcogar and you'll find more - including at least one
more passworded blog.
Brian
who was going to bed an hour ago.
2643
oeditor
Re: Josh revealed (slightly)
10/09/2006 10:08:00
--- In BlackShadow@yahoogroups.com, "oeditor" <b-jordan@...> wrote:
>
> = http://tinyurl.com/gcghu
>
> Google on blackcogar and you'll find more - including at least one
> more passworded blog.
>
> Brian
> who was going to bed an hour ago.
And should have done - that should have read "on blackcougar" of
course. I've had a look at some of his friends' blogs, and the nearest
they came to cretinism was one blogger quoting a hymn he liked.
Brian
2644
Roger Stanyard
Intelligent Design Shifting its Position
10/09/2006 11:51:00
When some of us met up with Lou from Science Just Science last month,
his opinion was that Intelligent Design is dying/dead. Americans now
realise that it is just religion and the main protagonists are now
milking it to get their money back, so to speak.
I raised this issue on Debunkcreationism and was basically told it
was wrong.
However, the more I look at what Lou said, the more the evidence
backs his view. I was wondering what others in Blackshadow feel.
There is a lively debate over this on Panda's Thumb at present which
gives a feel for what is going on.
However, my personal observations is that Jonathan Well's new book
and Ann Coulter's recent rantings are two further nails in the coffin
of ID. Well's book seems to have been pulled to pieces and he is
making a complete fool of himself (and ID)
Nevertheless, I suspect that he wrote it for the money and that it is
selling well. That it is causing further, apparently fairly serious,
damage to the ID movement seems to confirm Lou's view that the IDers
are trying to get as much money out of the movement as they can
before it collapses.
Moreover, Coulter's "endorsement" of ID, with the help of Dembski, is
so full of errors as to be risible, I'm told (neither works do I ever
intend to read).
It seems that Coulter's endorsement is part of a big change in
stragtegy that has followed Dover. Rather than ID pushing itself as
science and science alone, the movement is now moving to arguing that
evolution is politically and socially dangerous and is inherently
atheistic.
This ties with Lou's view that the DIers are basically dropping all
pretence that ID is not religious.
I also suspect that the shift is a big sign of desperation. The
movement is falling apart and it is an attempt to rally the troops
(even as the officers loot the silverware and desert ship).
I also suspect that Coulter is bad news for ID as well. She's a
product of the republican right of the late 1990s and earlyish parts
of this decades. The republican right, to put it mildly, is
increasingly seen by Americans through jaundiced eyes. Albeit
somewhat late, American has joined the rest of the human race in
seeing that Bush (Chimpy) and his people are incompetent third raters.
Coulter looks to me to increasingly be an also ran, preaching to an
ever smaller band of the already converted.
I think that it is very important for us in the UK to recognise what
is happening with ID and the change of direction in the "debate" in
the USA. It goes to the heart of creationism.
I also think that those of us that are pro-science might need to
rethink through some issues. My own position has basically been that
creationism is just plain wrong and bad religion to boot.
However, in a broader sense, the developments, as I see them in the
USA, seems to suggest that the pro-science camp will do itself a big
favour by recognising that a lot of people just feel uncomfortable
with the sheer analytical and rational coldness of science and its
distance from religion. Like it or not, many believe that science is
associated with atheism.
Indeed, much of the proselytising of the creationist movement centres
on pushing the connection that science = atheism and worse (science +
politics = Hitler/Pol Pot/Stalin). That we know it to be a pack of
lies and mass deceit to get converts is another matter.
Ken Miller continues to address this issue (see Panda's Thumb) and as
far as I can see, it is rapidly becoming a big part of the more
intelligent end of the public debate.
There is also another problem for us. We have always been able to
attack ID because of its claim that it is not religious. Dover has
meant we can shoot the IDers out of the water.
However, as the ID movement increasingly drops the pretence of being
independent of religious opinions, we are losing one of our big
weapons.
All comments gratefully received.
Roger
2645
Lenny Flank
Re: Intelligent Design Shifting its Position
10/09/2006 13:32:00
> When some of us met up with Lou from Science Just Science last month,
> his opinion was that Intelligent Design is dying/dead. Americans now
> realise that it is just religion and the main protagonists are now
> milking it to get their money back, so to speak.
>
Americans always KNEW it was just religion. The question was whether
the fundies had the political power to force it into schools anyway.
They don't.
ID is indeed dead. It has no political influence at all.
===================================
Lenny Flank
"There are no loose threads in the web of life"
Creation "Science" Debunked
http://www.geocities.com/lflank
My Reptile Page
http://www.geocities.com/lflank/herp.html
2646
Lenny Flank
Re: Intelligent Design Shifting its Position
10/09/2006 13:32:00
> This ties with Lou's view that the DIers are basically dropping all
> pretence that ID is not religious.
Nothing new here --- ICR did the very same thing back when it lost
*its* court case, in 1987. Now ICR, like DI, makes its living by
openly selling religious tracts to the faithful.
The whole POINT of ID was to push it into schools by pretending it's
science. Once that effort fails, there's no longer any point in
maintaining the pretense.
> Indeed, much of the proselytising of the creationist movement centres
> on pushing the connection that science = atheism
Sadly, much of the proselytising of the anti-IDers centers on the
same thing. One need only watch the hyper-atheists at Panda's Thumb
to see how badly that plays.
Science isn't any more "atheistic" than is economics, mathematics, or
the rules of football. Nor SHOULD it be. Turning this into a fight
between "theism" and "atheism" only helps the fundies.
> However, as the ID movement increasingly drops the pretence of being
> independent of religious opinions, we are losing one of our big
> weapons.
The flip side to that, of course, is that (at least in the US), as ID
becomes more and more openly religious, it becomes less and less
necessary to fight their presence in classrooms, since it is, in the
US, illegal to teach religious opinions in schools.
===================================
Lenny Flank
"There are no loose threads in the web of life"
Creation "Science" Debunked
http://www.geocities.com/lflank
My Reptile Page
http://www.geocities.com/lflank/herp.html
2647
Mikey Brass
Re: Intelligent Design Shifting its Position
10/09/2006 13:37:00
Creationism in the US is merely going into the beginning of another lull
stage but it will be back in another form. In the meantime, we are
merely feeling the beginning in England. It will, however, fail over
here because of very different socio-religious practices.
2648
Doug Devers
Re: Intelligent Design Shifting its Position
10/09/2006 13:44:00
bgcolor="#ffffff"
->
The flip side to that, of course, is that (at least in the US), as ID
becomes more and more openly religious, it becomes less and less
necessary to fight their presence in classrooms, since it is, in the
US, illegal to teach religious opinions in schools.
I know quite a few people here (in Oklahoma) who would dearly love to see that changed. A few even openly advocate some form of theocracy. Are we safe in assuming the constitution will forever prohibit that?
Doug
2649
Lenny Flank
Re: Intelligent Design Shifting its Position
10/09/2006 15:06:00
> Creationism in the US is merely going into the beginning of another
> lull stage but it will be back in another form.
Yep. If past history holds, it will take about ten years for a new
version to gain influence.
In the meantime, we
> are merely feeling the beginning in England. It will, however, fail
> over here because of very different socio-religious practices.
>
Creationism/ID seems to be uniquely an American phenomenon. I don't
think they will be able to successfully export their revolution
anywhere else.
===================================
Lenny Flank
"There are no loose threads in the web of life"
Creation "Science" Debunked
http://www.geocities.com/lflank
My Reptile Page
http://www.geocities.com/lflank/herp.html
2650
Lenny Flank
Re: Intelligent Design Shifting its Position
10/09/2006 15:08:00
>
>
>
> The flip side to that, of course, is that (at least in the US), as
> ID becomes more and more openly religious, it becomes less and
> less necessary to fight their presence in classrooms, since it is,
> in the US, illegal to teach religious opinions in schools.
>
> I know quite a few people here (in Oklahoma) who would dearly love to
> see that changed. A few even openly advocate some form of theocracy.
> Are we safe in assuming the constitution will forever prohibit that?
As long as there is a First Amendment that gets enforced.
If that ever changes, then "science education" will become the very
LEAST of our problems.
And at that point, I submit that we as a people are justified in
doing whatever becomes necessary to restore the rule of Consitutional
law. Take that how you will.
===================================
Lenny Flank
"There are no loose threads in the web of life"
Creation "Science" Debunked
http://www.geocities.com/lflank
My Reptile Page
http://www.geocities.com/lflank/herp.html
